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Dallas Rampage

joseph's Avatar

Let us pray for the families of the fallen police officers and all who suffered.

Paul Ortega
Alli G
Kathleen C
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joseph's Avatar

Kenneth, right on. a nation divided against itself can not stand.

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kdc's Avatar

After signing onto my Kickstarter account, I found on their front page directly under their Kickstarter logo a hashtag for Black Lives Matter. I refuse to support anyone who supports violence against the police and canceled my Kickstarter account.

David
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sunto's Avatar

I would like to think all lives matter there's good and bad in every race of people.

As I have free will I choose to be good . Some police maybe not be as white as snow . Not all black Americans are bad and gangsters am I wrong . The chemistry is wrong some ware something needs to change . I do know one thing if the uk had a real gun culture we would be blasting each other to bits too. Good and bad is part of life and an unstoppable I personally believe. It's just a sad situation.

Kim L
Kathleen C
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kabuj's Avataree_badge

I feel it necessary to reply..for the record, I have NO PROBLEM with the "Black Lives Matter" Group and feel their cause is decent, noble and smart.and Kickstarter will continue to have my support and the support of many others.. That being said...

People like to make the statement.. "All Lives Matter" or "Blue Lives Matter" which to most people is obvious, but it's not the point.....

It's obvious to me that if a group has a cause.. Like "Breast Cancer"  or "Battered Women", etc.. etc.. it does not impy nor mean that the people in support of those groups do not care about "Lung Cancer" (for example) or "Battered Children" (for example).. it simply means that it is not the focus of their specific cause which they feel is needed and lacks current focus. So "black Lives Matter" is simply a cause they have chosen to emphasize and does not mean anything else or any other life does not matter....

It's pretty simple and clear to me, but I'm not trying to convince anyone to change your mind on this issue and it's unlikely you're going to change mine. It's a free country and people will disagree.

God bless the families of the officers and their loved ones for such horrible crime and unnecessary loss of lives.

David
Alli G
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kabuj's Avataree_badge

David,

"some police maybe not be as white as snow" (understatement).. not expecting them to be "white as snow" just not to kill suspects unnecessarily..

"not all black americans are bad and gangsters" (understatement)... I would say 99.999% of them are not bad and gangsters.

But I get the jist of your point.

David
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allig's Avatarg8_badge

I would say it's important to keep in mind that BLM's official platform is police accountability, a cause that I personally support.  I sat in criminal court for 7 years (Florida).  I've seen the demographics firsthand day after day for years, and they are overwhelmingly disproportionate.  I've seen cops lie on the stand, proved to have planted evidence, etc.  True, most *are* good cops, and I support those guys.  In court we say there are bad cops just like there are bad butchers and bakers and candlestick makers.  But the thing is, butchers and bakers and candlestick makers aren't empowered by the people to be an authority over other people's lives and liberty, so it's direly important that they be accountable.

I'm sure there are some people celebrating the deaths of cops and calling it Black Lives Matter.  Westboro Baptist Church hatefully pickets soldier's funerals and calls it Christianity.  In both instances, the real message is getting hijacked by those calling themselves its representatives and it's wholly a lie.  The devil doesn't care what you call yourself or what your skin color is.... as long as you're not loving each other, bottom line.  I live here in Dallas, and the main talking points circling around here is reminders that the people protesting a legitimate concern didn't do this.  One person did this.  There was a beautiful op-ed in the Dallas Morning News today calling for the city to unite and teach each other.

#DallasStrong

David
williamj
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kabuj's Avataree_badge

ALi G...... VERY WELL SAID..

Alli G
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joseph's Avatar

I believe the focus should be on black on black crime for the black lives matter movement because blacks that are killed by other blacks, should matter too.

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kabuj's Avataree_badge

Actually, Black churches, entertainers and various groups in general have chosen to focus on "Black on black" crime as part of their concerns. It's not a new concept and they are not mutually exclusive.

You may believe they should focus on "black on black" crime (or white on white crime for that matter), BUT they have chosen to focus on "Cop on Black Crime" ( it appears).

WHO are you (or me or anyone) to tell them which cause to focus on. They chose a cause I believe happens to be worthy. I personally am MUCH more concerned with a police officer who commits crimes than I am with a common thug or criminal (by definition). Police carry a badge and a gun which allows them to have authority to make choices which can kill people. When the governing authorities have no rule of law... there is no law (in essence) and then their is just chaos..

Anyone is free to focus on whatever subject they decide and ANYBODY can start a group to emphasize on any subject (you too).

Thank God we live in a free country.

David
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sunto's Avatar

K J 

Common sense is not that common . I am happy that you got my point. 

Best wi

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allig's Avatarg8_badge

@ Joseph

While it is true that that is a problem, it's also a predictable result of large communities who are poor and lack access to quality education and job opportunities.  Sociologically speaking, this scenario plays out on every continent in every period of the entirety of written history.  It's not race specific.  It's what humans do in light of those circumstances.  If you've ever heard of the "dark ages", it's the same exact thing.  It doesn't make it excusable, but it does make it an undeniable factor of humanity: Poverty + no opportunity = violent cities every time.  That's why the poorest countries are always the most dangerous.  That's why Somalia has so many pirates.  That's why ISIS recruits from the poor neighborhoods.  People who have a good education, good jobs and families have too much to lose.  So we can sit here all day and talk about what these communities should do, but the reality is that's not what happens across the globe and across history.

True, there are a fortunate few who can pull themselves through all that adversity and come out on top.  It's called differential sensitivity, which basically means their personality is genetically blessed to be able to overcome it.  It's great when those examples appear, but pointing at them and saying "See! They did it!" is no solution because they are not most people.  Most people need help, and that's why God meant us to help each other.  Christ said when you see a hungry man on the street, don't tell him you'll pray for him. Give him bread.  The fastest way to pull an entire community out of poverty and crime is to provide quality education and job opportunity.  Right now, a lot of these communities have very low quality education which in turn precludes them from opportunity.  Even if education was fixed today, it would still take at least two generations to see drastic change, so it's not just change, it's a commitment.

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bobf's Avatargold

I'm afraid more deaths will come if the protesters don't dial it back at least for the time being. Everyone has their finger on the trigger with all that has happened in a short period. They are blocking streets where an ambulance of firetruck could be stalled.

Here's a new study on police stats. It is written by a Mr. Fryer, the youngest African-American to receive tenure at Harvard and the first one to receive a John Bates Clark medal, a prize given to the most promising American economist under 40

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/12/upshot/surpri...

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kabuj's Avataree_badge

@Rob F... Unless I'm missing something, police departments are not actally required to report shootings to a national data base and the report appears to have excluded many larger cities including New York and San Francisco as well as most cities in the South.

Nevertheless, my gut tells me that if you are more likely to be physically abused, things are more likely to escalate and result in a shooting or other lethal force.

Interesting stats nevertheless.

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bobf's Avatargold

In that light, I guess we should disregard the conclusion and that the abuse statements could also be inaccurate.   

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allig's Avatarg8_badge

Not to belabor the point, but just to clarify, it's not evidence from polls and statistics.  It's actually from decades of multidisciplinary research in the fields of Sociology, Psychology, Anthropology, and lately even genetics and other hard sciences.  I believe every individual is responsible for their actions, but if we're sitting on piles of research and field studies and academic communities with causes and solutions and do nothing, at what point does that become a share of responsibility?

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kabuj's Avataree_badge

Roger. Unfortunately I think you just described most of Americans these days. (to one degree or the other) Everybody seems to "accept their situation, get dependent on others paying their way, stop trying and blame everyone else for their situation"

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allig's Avatarg8_badge

I can't disagree with those sentiments.  I'm not an advocate for political correctness.  In fact, I think it's diminishing education at an alarming rate, particularly at the university level.  While the examples you give are absolutely true, that is not what research suggests needs to be done.  Passing people along doesn't help education at all.  It makes it even worse.  It may have been well-intentioned, but the results are a disaster.  So while I wholly agree with what you're saying, it still misses the mark because that was never the scientific solution to begin with.  It's part "feel good" policy and part "hit the quota" mentality that's overtaken US education.  

I might be a goodie do-gooder, but I still think things should make logical sense.  If we ask the question, how can we bring high quality education to low socioeconomic communities?  An illogical answer would be to just start giving passing grades.  If the question was, how can we make the numbers look like everyone is passing school, then that answer would make sense.  I won't get into all the details, but Finland's model is a good place to start.  They went from one of the lowest scoring countries to one of the top three in 20 years, and community income is no longer a factor whether a student will receive a quality education.  And they used innovation in remodeling their education system.  They didn't do what the US does and start coddling everyone through it.

I also agree there's a lot of "gimme a fish" mentality going around.  It's actually not anything new.  It's been well established since the beginning of the 19th century.  When America was a new country, there was a pretty big showdown between Alexander Hamilton and Thomas Jefferson about what kind of economy to build in this country.  Hamilton wanted to industrialize the US, Jefferson wanted an agrarian society (which would most certainly have its own pitfalls, but Hamilton won, so for efficiency, we'll address what came out of that.)  Jefferson's main concern with industrializing the US was that he foresaw it creating whole cities full of underpaid workers who are dependent on their employers and have no access to upward mobility of their own volition.  He practically yelled it from the rooftops.  And by the 1820s, that's exactly what was manifesting.  So it's part individual, but also we created a society that makes dependents.  Jefferson understood this because he was extraordinarily intelligent and understood things about humanity that most people don't.  

Quite frankly, I still think Hamilton's industrial society probably turned out better for the country than Jefferson's vision of a nation of farmers because most people are not capable of running their own farm.  But most people are generally some degree of dependent, and our economic structure encourages it.  As a matter of fact, our economic structure pretty much depends on most people being at the bottom.

And like I said, there's definitely those shining stars that appear that pull themselves out of the slums and become hugely successful.  But again, that's differential sensitivity for you.  That's where new knowledge about genetics and epigenetics is starting to make the picture more clear.  That's another avenue that needs to be incorporated into how students are being educated.  Our system is not working on many, many levels.  And you're absolutely right that PC and passing people through is probably the worst idea anyone has ever had.  It leaves absolutely no legacy effect.

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bobf's Avatargold

Those are interesting stories, Alli and Roger.

If we were an agrarian society what would we use as ammo in a war? I guess we could throw corn at the enemy. Industrial mite and innovation is what wins most wars.

Industrial related type work places give many a chance to work their way up and many don't require college degrees. That's what I did and that's what I witnessed others doing. I also noticed some didn't want to move up and were content to remain where they started. Then there are those that find selling drugs, etc. much easier and lucrative than working their way up.

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bobf's Avatargold

Just found out that 3 people of 4 were caught plotting attacks on Baton Rouge police. This is why protestors should not gather because it will make police gather in bunches.

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allig's Avatarg8_badge

Hahahaha, Rob, if we were an agrarian society, we probably wouldn't have many enemies that need fighting against.  I mean, who picks on farmers?  That's just cruel :P

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bobf's Avatargold

LOL

We would probably be speaking German. They do have pretty good beer tho.

Alli G
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allig's Avatarg8_badge

They have awesome beer!

Rob F
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sunto's Avatar

An educational video it could help . I may after share that Frank .

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